No Nion Lan Communcation through large switch

I expect that the switch is interfering with the communications, or the switch may be configured to route between VLANs that are configured on it. Regardless, if you can ping it, using the remote_link command with Pandad Interactive should allow you to communicate. Your IT person should be able to configure the switch to let the communications through. Make no mistake, this has nothing to do with how "big" the switch is. This has EVERYTHING to do with the configuration of the switch.

There are many installations around the world that utilize even large core type switches. Once the IT guy doing the configuration gets the switch properly programmed, everything works very well.

For example, here in our testing lab we have a Brocade FastIron SuperX:
http://www.brocade.com/sites/dotcom/pro … index.page

and in my office I have two of the Brocade FastIron Edge FES2402 switches:
http://www.brocade.com/sites/dotcom/pro … index.page

I have them currently configured to pass two VLANs between the SuperX and the FES's, one for our control network and one for the CobraNet network, over one Gigabit copper link. I am very happy with the performance of this Brocade hardware and we are supporting it in the NWare software. (look in the device list "Devices>nControl Devices>Switches" and you will find the 2402 and the LS624).

What needs to be done to the configuration of your switch to make it work? That's a good question. I've never had to configure one fo those Linksys models before, but the fact that it is a Linksys and not a Cisco model tells me that it is really classified by the manufacturer as a lower line model and may not allow you to modify the configuration acceptably. After reading through the description that is offered by one of the dealers online ( http://www.linksysworks.com/SRW224G4P.asp ) I am afraid that their "Intellegent Broadcast and Multicast storm control" may simply be stopping the multicast discovery process that is used by the NIONs. You need to shut this off or make it less sensitive, but I'm going to guess that they will not allow you to do that. The fact that they talk about "Class of Service" but not "Quality of Service" is almost a dead giveaway that they are not going to allow you to modify the necessary parameters to allow this switch to work properly with NION... but that's just a guess on my part since I've never configured a Cisco switch. My experience is limited to the WRT54G WiFi router I have at home and the Brocade hardware I have at work... well, I take that back, I've also successfully used some ancient Bay Networks 24 port switches and some old HP Procurve gear too.

After reading the published information about this particular network switch, it appears that it is specifically geared towards aggregating VoIP telephones out of the box and will require significant configuration modifications to allow it to be "just a normal network switch". I hope they have allowed you the necessary tools to make it behave normally.

I am really not looking forward to the prospect of having to create a "black-list" of network switches that come so preconfigured that they can not be used with our systems. This is especially frustrating as our systems are built around standard industry protocols that have been in existance for 10 years or more! Remember, the NION control network should be just a flat network with the IP addressing scheme of A.A.A.B where A=same and B=different. The CobraNet network should similarly be a flat network. No routers allowed. (unless you need to bridge control information from one VLAN to the other.)

Anyhow, the short story is that your switch is not "just a network switch". It is doing a lot of traffic management and I expect that it will not play nicely with either NION communications nor CobraNet.

It is frustrating that we are such a small segment of the market that a call to Cisco results in a quizzical look of "WTF is this crazy loon talking about?" Even though CobraNet has been around for almost a decade at this point.

Hi Mitch-

I find it very interesting that your computer is not recieving a response from the pings to the NION. Clearly, the NION is recieving the ping and I am certain that it is responding. However, I would not be surprised if the "Intellegent Broadcast and Multicast storm control" in your network switch is just blocking all communications from the NION, because of the following traffic that is coming from the NION:

1. Each NION sends a "System Health" packet to 239.0.0.10:1234 ten times a second. This means every 0.1 seconds a tiny little packet that says "I'm okay!" is sent from each NION to everything else that is subscribed to this multicast address.

2. Each NION sends a "Discovery" packet to 239.0.0.10:4321 once every five seconds. This is how the NIONs and nControls and your computer running NWare find one another by getting these Discovery packets from everyone that is subscribed to this multicast address.

3. Port 4000 is the port that the NIONs, nControl, and your computer all use to pass control information across the network. This port needs to be open.

To someone who is just looking at the number of packets running around on the network, the System Health and Discovery packets would appear to be a lot of traffic. However, all these packets are VERY VERY SMALL. So, even though there are a lot of them, they do not aggregate into very much actual traffic.

I expect that if you can open these pathways in that network switch, you can make it function for NION and NWare communications.

In the future, I would make a general practice of avoiding network switches with this kind of "intellegence" built into them. It is highly desireable to have "wire-speed" communication through a devcie that is "just a network switch".

Good luck, and please let us know how you come out.

Maybe someone else on here who is a little more familiar with the Cisco / Linksys network gear can give a few tips on how to fix the configuration in this switch.

Regardless, I'm glad that you got it working. Also, I am glad that you actually CAN modify the behavior of this switch to make it work correctly. After I saw the price tag for it from a few different retailers, I was extremely hopeful that it could be reconfigured.

Anyhow, I'm glad it is working for you!

I don't blame the guy for being rushed...it was an issue that needed to be fixed immediately as handover to the client was happening very, very soon (the next day) and we needed to have the Kisok working. This was the first time we were using this switch and were not anticipating any problems so didn't leave much extra time for troubleshooting.

Not that I'm defending his actions, but I feel that this situation was best resolved given the situation and then the root cause to be found in a controlled environment at a later time.

I certainly did not intend to throw all intellegent switches under the bus. Quite the contrary as I really appreciate having the ability to look at what a network switch is doing. However, if the network switches are coming preconfigured in such a way that makes it super easy for VoIP systems to be installed and our products end up not working because of this configuration... well, color me not a happy camper.

This is a very good question and if you look at each discipline with a very wide angle lens, I think it becomes very apparent that it is the audio people who should be learning IT.

I say this because coming from an audio background, I have had to learn a lot about IT related things. Not to mention that IT departments exist in nearly every company that has more than a handful of people working for it. The result is that IT people have a tremendous amount of purchasing power at their disposal for Audio/Video related equipment. After all, when the widget factory in town needs to update the technology in their conference room, or they want to get into video conferencing or tele-presence, who do they charge with the task of getting this done? Do they call the local A/V integrator? No. The Audio and Video is only a part of what they are doing. They are going to go to their own in house IT department and have them build a solution.

There are classes and certifications that can be had to develop a person's IT chops. While there are a lot of organizations that do a lot of good audio and video related training, we do not have the same thing in the audio industry. Of course education isn't everything, as with all disciplines work in the field is where the rubber meets the road and this is where IT people who are trying to learn A/V have a tendancy to come up very short. They can do all the book learning they want, but when asked how to remove the hum in the sound system in the conference room they suddenly realize that they have no idea why it is humming in the first place and since they can't translate their software troubleshooting skills to hardware troubleshooting, they have a seriously tough time.

I highly encourage anyone who is an A/V person and wants to improve their career prospects to learn all they can about IT. We have a significant leg up on all the IT people who are trying to learn A/V. We learned the hard part (audio and video) first, now we need to go learn the easier IT part. Once we tear down the fence separating A/V and IT, we all can provide our customers with better integrated systems that leverage the best of both fields.

Sure! If there is some interest in discussing this further, a new thread is certainly welcome!

However, it should probably be started in the "Hints/Tips/Discussion" forum.

I believe a lot of potential problems could be avoided with more pre-Tender/Installation research into which Network equipment is to be spec'd and how it is to be configured based on the criteria of the particular project. For my money there are too many A/V engineers out there that are guilty of neglecting this portion of a given project and end up at the last minute spec'in a manufacturers switch based on reputation and on how many big running projects this particular switch is used. Don't get me wrong,this isn't necessarily the worst place in the world to be coming from but there is no real understanding or fore thought into what it entails to get this technology working with the Audio equipment that is to be deployed on the Network. Sure 'Wembley Stadium' is up and running using this Technology but what did the Network administrator have to do to achieve this?? Just because there are successful running systems using this brand and model doesn't mean that it's a given that it will work out of the box for another project, no two Networks are Identical.       
Of course there are a lot of A/V systems going into play with existing IT Networks,this is where the IT Network consultant needs to be pre-educated on what is expected of the Network for the Audio equipment to run successfully. Information is King and if we don't know,there's always someone who does. No doubt there are many possible pitfalls when piecing a Network together but I believe that sometimes not enough time is allocated at the design stage of projects to combat these pitfalls.

Steve,your quite right communication and documentation between the two party's is of paramount importance. Also Like Jason and yourself most/all switches I've used with Cobranet and Nion Comms have worked from a default configuration.